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Reim Lunettes

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PostSubject: Retrace 86   Sun Sep 01, 2013 12:41 am

Whoa, there haven't been any manga discussions in a while, and the recent Retrace 86 was just awesome. I'm beginning to have hope of a happy ending! What did anyone else think?
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Little_Marionette

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PostSubject: Re: Retrace 86   Sun Sep 01, 2013 11:25 am

Given the fact that I read it last night or better said early morning ( 2/3 am) I had a hard time actually understanding what was going on. Then again who should read stuff like Ph that late at night.
Eitherway I am actually really thrilled about the way Rufus managed to think about his plan, how Sheryl had trust in him, knowing he would never betray her. I just love how it showed how deep their friendship goes.

And how can we forgot the way Break got Mad Hatter back, that panel in itself was so powerful, I got shivers down my spine. There is a tiny hope for it being a happy ending but I myself I am a lover of tragic endings but knowing Jun it might go both ways? Give the lovers of happy endings something to gush about but still make a move to make it bittersweet. I can smell the ending coming though!!

What did others think about how Lottie seems to question the Baskerville ways? We've seen it in previous chapters, now again in this one and for some reason I really find it interesting that no matter how much she wants to serve Glen/Oswald she still can see past that. Wow, sorry for this massive post but when I get started I just can't stop!
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Reim Lunettes

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PostSubject: Re: Retrace 86   Mon Sep 02, 2013 6:26 am

Hi Little_Marionette! I've had a hard time understanding why Lottie might want to possibly break from the Baskervilles? I've heard others mention that...maybe you can clue me in to what I might have missed.

What I got out of 86 was that we'd been led to believe that those earrings Rufus Barma gave Cheryl so many years ago (and which he stole back after stabbing her in front of the Baskervilles) were the Rainsworth key, when in fact they were the Barma key. The Rainsworth key (which was the locket shown in this chapter) had been in his possession the whole time, and he used that key to temporarily disable the chains contracted by Rainsworth house: Owl, Eques and Mad Hatter. Then he let the Rainsworths be captured "wagering" that their chains would reactivate right when all the Baskervilles were gathered, thereby causing an imminent threat to them, since Mad Hatter can kill them all, in theory at least. There was a lot more going on in the chapter though, but that was the crux of it for me.
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Little_Marionette

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PostSubject: Re: Retrace 86   Mon Sep 02, 2013 3:26 pm

Hi Reim!
Yes I would gladly help you understand. Remember when Glen ( Leo) killed off those Pandora Agents just for mentioning Jack's name? Lottie seemed shocked and mildly disgusted, not quite understanding that the Master she knew so well could do something so brutal. In Retrace 79 ( Falling) she also seems shocked that Glen ordered the Baskerville's to kill Gilbert, orders he would never have given if he were in the right state of mind. The old Glen ( Oswald) wouldn't have done such a thing so quickly but now he is filled with anguish and the need for revenge and Lottie seems to pick that up.

In her behaviour and how she responds to the way the Baskerville's are operating after Glen's return shows how she isn't impressed. In retrace 86 page 8 when Doug and the others bring Break in, Lottie isn't making any move to come closer. A big change as to how she behaved when she was still searching for Glen. She now prefers to stay on the sideline instead of jumping right in. It is not said she wants to break from the Baskervilles, surely not at all, her loyality to Glen is too huge for her to take such a step.

But she is doubting his approach towards the situation, finding it too harsh. So I think she is the first who dares to put question marks in regard to Glen's behaviour. I, for one, find that really interesting. In a sense that's character devolopment and growth- she isn't blind to what she sees.
Hope that cleared it up for you?

Now moving to retrace 86 it self, thank you for summarizing it for me. I have re-read it myself again and I simply can't stop admiring the sheer slyness and brilliance of Rufus' plan. In a sense I am happy that Break got Mad Hatter back but that will only destroy him in the end, knowing him he will want to attack the Baskerville's then and there, practically using up whichever last resources he has left. If not for the interference of either Sheryl or Sharon because we all know how reckless Break can get when it comes to wanting to destroy certain people for either the sake of his plan or the promise he made with the Intention of the Abyss.
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Reim Lunettes

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PostSubject: Re: Retrace 86   Mon Sep 02, 2013 5:26 pm

Great explanation! It makes so much more sense now about Lottie.

I love how so much of the plot is moved by the feelings various characters have for one another. But that's more of a general comment.

I have a feeling Mad Hatter won't be the death of Break after all, but maybe that's just wishful thinking. I still think that he may be a misplaced Child of Misfortune from an earlier or later era, and I am expecting and hope for a scene in which Vincent is confronted by his own cowardice (I believe Vincent didn't just stop the Raven transfer ceremony to save Gilbert, but to save himself, knowing his eventual fate would be to drop into Abyss. This is hinted at when Vincent is talking to Elliot at the end of his life.)

About 86, I wondered when Break said that he got Mad Hatter because The Intention of the Abyss wished for it. I wonder in what way having a chain-destroying chain would help her achieve her wish of not wanting to be the Intention of the Abyss anymore?

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Bakura

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PostSubject: Re: Retrace 86   Wed Sep 18, 2013 3:47 pm

Reim Lunettes wrote:
Whoa, there haven't been any manga discussions in a while, and the recent Retrace 86 was just awesome. I'm beginning to have hope of a happy ending! What did anyone else think?
Yes, I do think that it is moving towards a happy ending since Rufus' plan did work. As good as that is, I just can't stop worrying about Break dying from using the mad hatter even if they are able to escape. And then we still have the issue with Echo, so there are still quite a few complications left.
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